WTH

[bronko220002]

Boy am I dumb! My last post I was talking about my outing with the Scout SML and the differences in groups with the 300 gr SSTs over the last time out. Well I went back and was checking my records and the 300 gr SSTs were sized and used in my Knight .45 Moutaineer. I was using 250 FTX bullets in my Scout. Heck I even ordered the Furys in 300 grain! Rats...now I'm undecided if I should order 250 or 275 gr Furys. I think I'll hold off until the next outing and run the 250 FTXs again and see how they do.
I guess I'll try the 300 Furys in the Mountaineer with BH209. I was going to go out today but it looks like it could rain any minute and its really blowing out there.
Encore, I ran the 250s through the sizer a couple more times to remove all the bounce back. That should be a total of 5x through the sizer. I found what I believe to be my ideal bullet diameter is - right at .451" (measured with a micrometer not a dial caliper for better accuracy).

 

[ElDiablo]

Gets confusing in a hurry when you’re shooting multiple rifles.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Keep your log book at hand and write down data immediately. I use the note app on my phone then transfer it to the log book after the session. Whatever you do, do it right away… with age, the memory is the second thing to go… can’t remember the first.

 

[snapbang]

My memory is like a steal trap. I just need to be reminded whos driving, where im going, and what we were talking about.

 

[ENCORE50A]

........................... Encore, I ran the 250s through the sizer a couple more times to remove all the bounce back. That should be a total of 5x through the sizer. I found what I believe to be my ideal bullet diameter is - right at .451" (measured with a micrometer not a dial caliper for better accuracy).

I'm only shooting one rifle (always) and normally only one bullet at a time whenever at the range. I always keep a note pad in my loading box to keep track.
There have been a few times where I do shoot different weights or different bullets, but the note pad is out and recording.
It'll be interesting if your measured diameter works for all bullets, such as 275's and 300gr.
I size by actual measured force. Quite different than most.

 

[ElDiablo]

I size by actual measured force. Quite different than most.

Different bullets size differently even on the same sizer setting, so I too find that you have to test each in your particular rifle.

 

[bronko220002]

Different bullets size differently even on the same sizer setting, so I too find that you have to test each in your particular rifle.

I hear what you're saying Diablo but I'm not certain I agree, Running through the sizer one time may produce different results caused by bounce back due to bullet composition but running them through a sizing die multiple times will actually work harden the jacket and it should stay the same diameter.
Just for giggles I'm going to run a few different bullets through my die multiple times then check them after a couple days. I'll use my micrometer that is calibrated to national standards.

 

[Kodiak2]

With those same bullets, try another test.
Place them in the refrigerator for a couple of days and see how they measure. You might be surprised.

 

[ElDiablo]

I hear what you're saying Diablo but I'm not certain I agree, Running through the sizer one time may produce different results caused by bounce back due to bullet composition but running them through a sizing die multiple times will actually work harden the jacket and it should stay the same diameter.
Just for giggles I'm going to run a few different bullets through my die multiple times then check them after a couple days. I'll use my micrometer that is calibrated to national standards.

No, in my experience, they all don’t size the same even on the same setting. I run everything through three to five passes.

 

[ENCORE50A]

I hear what you're saying Diablo but I'm not certain I agree, Running through the sizer one time may produce different results caused by bounce back due to bullet composition but running them through a sizing die multiple times will actually work harden the jacket and it should stay the same diameter.
Just for giggles I'm going to run a few different bullets through my die multiple times then check them after a couple days. I'll use my micrometer that is calibrated to national standards.

I have to agree with Diablo on this one, but there may be some misunderstanding???? ????

As an example............ Size a 250gr FTX bullet to fit ... your perfect ... loading force, say even after 5 passes. If you take a 325gr FTX and try to use the same setting, you'll most likely not get the bullet down the bore.
There's a reason, which is the total amount of surface area being sized. You have more surface area on heavier, longer bullet. So there ..... can ....... be a difference in die settings.

As an example....... I'm sizing 300gr XLD's right now to load in a clean barrel at 30#, and that's with 5 die passes.
If.............. I leave my die setting untouched and try to size 350gr XLD's using 5 die passes, they will be too tight to go down the barrel and I have to increase the die setting.

 

[bronko220002]

Diablo I see you're comparing bearing surface vs diameter. Its obvious that more bearing surface will require more loading pressure but that's only due to friction between bullet and bore. That has nothing to do with diameter.
I just ran a series of bullets thru my sizing die. I used a 45 cal Maxiball in pure lead as my standard. Bullets sized were:
300 and 400 gr Furys
300 gr XTP
300 gr SST
250 gr FTX
300,gr Smackdown
295 gr TEZ
300 gr Shockwave
I measured the original diameters and then sized 5x and measured again. I'm going to wait 2 days then measure then again after 7 days to see if the is any bounce back.
The Barnes TEZ is a flop because it was already below the die setting so no additional measurements were taken.as for the other 6 bullets the max spread was only .0003" (.4519"-.4516"). That's really not enough to even worry about but I'm going to wait the 7 days to post final results.

 

[ElDiablo]

I understand what you’re saying Bronko. And I agree to a point. The other variables are jacket thickness, composition and bullet design. As you saw with your measurements - all bullets (even with equal bearing surface) won’t size identically on one sizer setting. And the point Encore and I are trying to make is you can’t just size to a measured caliber - you really have to size to loading pressure. (Which will also change with ambient conditions.) Way too many variables at play.

 

[jsteurrys]

With those same bullets, try another test.
Place them in the refrigerator for a couple of days and see how they measure. You might be surprised.

How about the Freezer?

 

[bronko220002]

The shrinkage factor for pure lead is .0000001" per degree F. So going from 80* to 30* is only .000005". Nothing to even be concerned about. And copper shrinks even less. The coldest temp you could hunt in does not effect the bullet diameter.

 

[bronko220002]

So let me get this straight Encore and Diablo. What your saying is that you're not concerned about bullet diameter, only loading pressure?
So if your bullet has a longer bearing surface you would need a smaller diameter for equal loading pressure than one with a shorter bearing surface (surface touching the bore).
Example for giggles: a 250 gr FTX has a bearing surface of about 1/2" so I size it to .4519" to get a nice loading pressure. Now I take a 300 gr SST that has a bearing surface of about 3/4" (not exact) so to get the same load pressure I would have to size the bullet to, say, .4513".
Seems to me that would cause more gas escaping from around the bullet. I just can't seem to grasp that logic relying only on loading pressure.

 

[ElDiablo]

Yes

 

[ElDiablo]

The shrinkage factor for pure lead is .0000001" per degree F. So going from 80* to 30* is only .000005". Nothing to even be concerned about. And copper shrinks even less. The coldest temp you could hunt in does not effect the bullet diameter.

Not true

 

[ENCORE50A]

Yes. Loading force.
For the life of me, I couldn't tell you the diameter of my sized bullets. Never checked one. I only go by force to load.

 

[45-70]

I size mine as I load , got caught on spring back at Atterbury once and got one stuck in middle of relay

 

[bronko220002]

Not true

Most definately. Google lead shrinkage factor. It is 10 to the -6 power. Then calculate how much difference 50* would make.